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Alex Kac - CEO/Founder 
We got a Nexus one in-house today. In general, there are aspects of this phone I love and prefer over my iPhone greatly, and aspects that I feel are greatly unfinished, unpolished, or I just don't like.
Loves:
Not so loves:
To me the major difference between the iPhone and Nexus 1 come from a philosophical difference of user interface. iPhone uses UI elements at the expense of screen real-estate to show the user what they can do. Contextual back button, on screen menus. Android has maximum real-estate with an ever-present context-less back and menu buttons. Perfect for power users who can memorize what's there. As a sidenote, on upgraded apps, you can see what's new on the iphone. On Android I surmise you'd have to explore.
This philosophical difference is a big deal. As big a deal as physical keyboard vs soft keyboard to many. Neither is right or wrong. Best thing to do is know the difference, pick the phone you want, and let us write the best software /to/ that phone's strengths. I've come to really like Android in the form of the Nexus One. and could use it as my only phone. I prefer the iPhone's philosophy though.
Edit: For the most part I am really liking the Nexus One. Its smooth, easy to use in most areas. Don't get me wrong, the above were my impressions as a new user without any prior experience. I do not intend to say one thing is BAD or GOOD. I am simply giving my impressions. The fact is that the Nexus One is the first Android phone I could use as my primary, even though I prefer the iPhone.
For an up to date list of what I'm thinking of the Nexus One:http://twitter.com/webis_mobile
Loves:
- Screen. Fantastic. In most apps I didn't really see much difference from my iPhone, but then I went into Maps and....oh wow. Its incredible. I mean its....I don't know if I can ever use the iPhone maps app again.
- Android notifications
- The new Nexus One keyboard is FAR better than any other Android I've seen. Not as good as iPhone, but very very close.
Not so loves:
- Back Button. I just think its bad UI.
- No multi-touch in maps or anywhere else but keyboard. This is almost enough to negate the love above of the high res screen.
- I'm not really in love with the idea that I have to hit a menu button to get my menus and actions. I really prefer the iPhone way where stuff is always on screen. if there are menus, I get a control that shows that. I just feel like there are hidden parts to the apps. It doesn't make me feel right.
Example is Amazon app. I open it and I get a screen like the first screen on the iPhone Amazon app. But what now? On the iPhone there are tabs at the bottom. I have by now figured out to hit the menu button and then hit a tab...but this just feels wrong again. Not liking that at all. - Navigation on this phone just does not feel intuitive. Even with the 1Ghz snapdragon it also feels - even though its smooth - it feels like its just barely hanging on to my finger.
- App-wise it just feels really limited. Not much that it comes with. No clock, no weather, no stocks, no lots of stuff. EDIT: OK I found this is wrong. I didn't realize the little matrix of dots in the middle was the actual app list. I thought it was the dialer until I hit it. Sigh...not a big fan of that really. Two ways to launch apps. I think iPhone does it better and I don't think that's very good anymore either.
- I downloaded the Amazon app. But I never got a notification it finished downloading and I can't find it. Where is it? I go to Marketplace and go to Downloaded - and boom there it is, but its no where on my Android launch apps page. Why??? EDIT: Its in apps folder. Not in love with that.
To me the major difference between the iPhone and Nexus 1 come from a philosophical difference of user interface. iPhone uses UI elements at the expense of screen real-estate to show the user what they can do. Contextual back button, on screen menus. Android has maximum real-estate with an ever-present context-less back and menu buttons. Perfect for power users who can memorize what's there. As a sidenote, on upgraded apps, you can see what's new on the iphone. On Android I surmise you'd have to explore.
This philosophical difference is a big deal. As big a deal as physical keyboard vs soft keyboard to many. Neither is right or wrong. Best thing to do is know the difference, pick the phone you want, and let us write the best software /to/ that phone's strengths. I've come to really like Android in the form of the Nexus One. and could use it as my only phone. I prefer the iPhone's philosophy though.
Edit: For the most part I am really liking the Nexus One. Its smooth, easy to use in most areas. Don't get me wrong, the above were my impressions as a new user without any prior experience. I do not intend to say one thing is BAD or GOOD. I am simply giving my impressions. The fact is that the Nexus One is the first Android phone I could use as my primary, even though I prefer the iPhone.
For an up to date list of what I'm thinking of the Nexus One:http://twitter.com/webis_mobile
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dan55
09 January 2010 - 05:33 AM
hi Alex,
sounds very interesting - could it be what the iphone hasnt managed yet for me - a real smartphone - sounds like it :)
a year to wait for contract to end :( ;)
cheers
dan
sounds very interesting - could it be what the iphone hasnt managed yet for me - a real smartphone - sounds like it :)
a year to wait for contract to end :( ;)
cheers
dan
Dannno
09 January 2010 - 09:53 AM
Why can't we have customizable UI's? For starters, have a SIMPLE and POWER USER choice. Or let the user create that. I thought object-oriented programming's big promise was this, but it never came to be.
opuntia
09 January 2010 - 10:51 AM
Glad you have the phone because to me that can only mean your taking the PI for android seriously!
I just picked up the Droid after spending close to 9 years now with WM, and even though I know WM inside out and was completely comfortable with it, after the switch I'm never looking back (ok, maybe not never, but not to WM 6.5 or earlier, and I doubt WM7 either). It's such a smoother UI and overall more enjoyable experience. There are always things that you have to get used to when switching to a new OS and no one is perfect. I do think Android is a good balance between the iphone and WM. It allows app greater access to key phone API's compare to the iphone.
My biggest gripe, and actually it's huge and the reason why I'll never say never to WM, is that MS Exchange integration is horrible. It only supports mail and contacts. With the Droid, Motorola included a corporate calendar, but you can't mark an appt private, you can't search the company directory, no Tasks!, limited functionality creating reoccurring appts, no categories...I'm sure there's more. That's why I can't wait for a PI for android.
There are two options for exchange on android Touchdown and just recently Roadsync. I tried Touchdown and it has way for features than the android options, but the UI is horrible and it's also missing key feature. I don't think Roadsync is out yet. What's interesing is that with both of these apps, they have their own built-in exchange support, they don't use android's.
I just picked up the Droid after spending close to 9 years now with WM, and even though I know WM inside out and was completely comfortable with it, after the switch I'm never looking back (ok, maybe not never, but not to WM 6.5 or earlier, and I doubt WM7 either). It's such a smoother UI and overall more enjoyable experience. There are always things that you have to get used to when switching to a new OS and no one is perfect. I do think Android is a good balance between the iphone and WM. It allows app greater access to key phone API's compare to the iphone.
My biggest gripe, and actually it's huge and the reason why I'll never say never to WM, is that MS Exchange integration is horrible. It only supports mail and contacts. With the Droid, Motorola included a corporate calendar, but you can't mark an appt private, you can't search the company directory, no Tasks!, limited functionality creating reoccurring appts, no categories...I'm sure there's more. That's why I can't wait for a PI for android.
There are two options for exchange on android Touchdown and just recently Roadsync. I tried Touchdown and it has way for features than the android options, but the UI is horrible and it's also missing key feature. I don't think Roadsync is out yet. What's interesing is that with both of these apps, they have their own built-in exchange support, they don't use android's.
cswroe
09 January 2010 - 01:48 PM
If HTC gets an OTA patch for the 3G next week, I will probably be keeping the Nexus and will be waiting for PI for android.....impatiently....
@wroemacne
@wroemacne
Alex Kac - CEO/Founder
09 January 2010 - 02:29 PM
Dannno, on 09 January 2010 - 09:53 AM, said:
Why can't we have customizable UI's? For starters, have a SIMPLE and POWER USER choice. Or let the user create that. I thought object-oriented programming's big promise was this, but it never came to be.
Customizable UIs are a pain in the butt. Object oriented doesn't do anything for customization - it does wonders for reuse. The more customizable a UI, the more buggy it can be, and the more difficult it can be to maintain. Not saying they are bad, I do like them in specific places. We worked with one OS that had an XML based customizable UI and it was a huge pain in the butt for the OEM and the developer.
Alex Kac - CEO/Founder
09 January 2010 - 02:31 PM
opuntia, on 09 January 2010 - 10:51 AM, said:
It allows app greater access to key phone API's compare to the iphone.
Are you sure about that? As far as I can tell that's not really true. I still have no access to calendaring. We still have to do our own sync and databases and all that. The iPhone's SDK is, at the moment, still deeper than Android's. Yes, there are areas that Android is better, but overall the iPhone's is still deeper, easier to use, and offers more. Now Android has really improved greatly in the last 18 months so I continue to expect that.
opuntia
09 January 2010 - 07:50 PM
Alex Kac - CEO/Founder, on 09 January 2010 - 02:31 PM, said:
opuntia, on 09 January 2010 - 10:51 AM, said:
It allows app greater access to key phone API's compare to the iphone.
Are you sure about that? As far as I can tell that's not really true. I still have no access to calendaring. We still have to do our own sync and databases and all that. The iPhone's SDK is, at the moment, still deeper than Android's. Yes, there are areas that Android is better, but overall the iPhone's is still deeper, easier to use, and offers more. Now Android has really improved greatly in the last 18 months so I continue to expect that.
No I'm not...you busted me on that. What I meant to say, and this is from only using other folks iphones, it just seems like android allows apps greater access to some of the phone's basic functions. And the Androids allows shortcuts, widgets, folders...on the home screen, which I think is great (a la the WM Today screen). But I'm not a developer and you are, so obviously I'll take 100% of your word on that.
That's interesting about not having access to calendering. So for the PI for Android are you going to have to develop your own MS Exchange Sync instead of relying on Androids? If yes, does that mean you'll be able to pull in tasks? Right now I have to use Remember The Milk for tasks since they have an android app, and it's actually really powerful, but there's no Outlook integration.
crogs
09 January 2010 - 08:18 PM
did you ever think of adding the amazon app to one of your home screens? no offense, but there's things you aren't happy about because you don't know how to use the phone. Of course the apps page will have everything and your home screens won't. Why would you want to clutter your home screen with every app?
If you want amazon on a home screen, hold and press the screen. Then add shortcut -> program -> amazon. Then you can actually place it wherever you like. You can then add widgets to make your home screen more to your liking. Maybe you want a stock ticker, sports scores or your upcoming agenda at a glance. You can download widgets to do that.
You place on your home screens only the things you want there, things that you just use daily or things you want quick access to. Why would anyone have to sort through pages and pages of apps regardless of how well you have them organized when you can create home screens that evolve to how you use the phone?
My main home screen has a 3 row 4 column agenda list giving me my upcoming appts. It's a free widget called CalWidget that I could have take up any combo of rows and columns. And two presses takes me to my calendar so I don't need a separate calendar button anywhere. Then I have email, browser and messaging buttons which are my three most used apps.
One flick to the right and that screen has a page of one touch quick dials. One flick left and I have a sports ticker widget that gives me updates on all my favorited teams that I also get notifications for when scores change.
And the list goes on. Maybe you want more home screens. There's Home replacement apps that can help. Check out aPanda in the app store. It's free, and you can use themes from other home apps.
Maybe you don't like a customizable UI because Apple doesn't let you have one. It could create more bugs but the upside is greater. The iPhone is and should be more refined for what it is. It's been out longer, and it's on one phone. Android gives you one thing Apple doesn't, choices. Embrace it and get us PI for Android because many of us are going through major PalmOS withdrawal and Iambic is of no help.
And if you wanted, you could setup android to resemble the iphone and lay your apps out on the home screen in the order you see fit and work from there.
If you want amazon on a home screen, hold and press the screen. Then add shortcut -> program -> amazon. Then you can actually place it wherever you like. You can then add widgets to make your home screen more to your liking. Maybe you want a stock ticker, sports scores or your upcoming agenda at a glance. You can download widgets to do that.
You place on your home screens only the things you want there, things that you just use daily or things you want quick access to. Why would anyone have to sort through pages and pages of apps regardless of how well you have them organized when you can create home screens that evolve to how you use the phone?
My main home screen has a 3 row 4 column agenda list giving me my upcoming appts. It's a free widget called CalWidget that I could have take up any combo of rows and columns. And two presses takes me to my calendar so I don't need a separate calendar button anywhere. Then I have email, browser and messaging buttons which are my three most used apps.
One flick to the right and that screen has a page of one touch quick dials. One flick left and I have a sports ticker widget that gives me updates on all my favorited teams that I also get notifications for when scores change.
And the list goes on. Maybe you want more home screens. There's Home replacement apps that can help. Check out aPanda in the app store. It's free, and you can use themes from other home apps.
Maybe you don't like a customizable UI because Apple doesn't let you have one. It could create more bugs but the upside is greater. The iPhone is and should be more refined for what it is. It's been out longer, and it's on one phone. Android gives you one thing Apple doesn't, choices. Embrace it and get us PI for Android because many of us are going through major PalmOS withdrawal and Iambic is of no help.
And if you wanted, you could setup android to resemble the iphone and lay your apps out on the home screen in the order you see fit and work from there.
Alex Kac - CEO/Founder
09 January 2010 - 08:34 PM
[quote name='opuntia' date='09 January 2010 - 07:50 PM'][quote name='Alex Kac - CEO/Founder' date='09 January 2010 - 02:31 PM']
That's interesting about not having access to calendering. So for the PI for Android are you going to have to develop your own MS Exchange Sync instead of relying on Androids? If yes, does that mean you'll be able to pull in tasks? Right now I have to use Remember The Milk for tasks since they have an android app, and it's actually really powerful, but there's no Outlook integration.[/quote]
Yes, we'd have to develop everything. Just like on iPhone.
That's interesting about not having access to calendering. So for the PI for Android are you going to have to develop your own MS Exchange Sync instead of relying on Androids? If yes, does that mean you'll be able to pull in tasks? Right now I have to use Remember The Milk for tasks since they have an android app, and it's actually really powerful, but there's no Outlook integration.[/quote]
Yes, we'd have to develop everything. Just like on iPhone.
Alex Kac - CEO/Founder
09 January 2010 - 08:39 PM
crogs, on 09 January 2010 - 08:18 PM, said:
did you ever think of adding the amazon app to one of your home screens? no offense, but there's things you aren't happy about because you don't know how to use the phone. Of course the apps page will have everything and your home screens won't. Why would you want to clutter your home screen with every app?
Correct - I didn't know how to use the phone, but that was my point: It wasn't obvious. And I don't like that. There is too much hidden with the menu button, the back button, and the home screens.
And yes, I did figure it out eventually (as I noted in my post).
Quote
If you want amazon on a home screen, hold and press the screen. Then add shortcut -> program -> amazon. Then you can actually place it wherever you like. You can then add widgets to make your home screen more to your liking. Maybe you want a stock ticker, sports scores or your upcoming agenda at a glance. You can download widgets to do that.
Again, very much non-obvious and I think this makes my point clearly. The iPhone UI is discoverable. The Android UI is not. Neither is bad. But its important to note because it involves a very different UI philosophy and that was the point I was trying to make.
Quote
You place on your home screens only the things you want there, things that you just use daily or things you want quick access to. Why would anyone have to sort through pages and pages of apps regardless of how well you have them organized when you can create home screens that evolve to how you use the phone?
My main home screen has a 3 row 4 column agenda list giving me my upcoming appts. It's a free widget called CalWidget that I could have take up any combo of rows and columns. And two presses takes me to my calendar so I don't need a separate calendar button anywhere. Then I have email, browser and messaging buttons which are my three most used apps.
One flick to the right and that screen has a page of one touch quick dials. One flick left and I have a sports ticker widget that gives me updates on all my favorited teams that I also get notifications for when scores change.
And the list goes on. Maybe you want more home screens. There's Home replacement apps that can help. Check out aPanda in the app store. It's free, and you can use themes from other home apps.
Maybe you don't like a customizable UI because Apple doesn't let you have one.
My main home screen has a 3 row 4 column agenda list giving me my upcoming appts. It's a free widget called CalWidget that I could have take up any combo of rows and columns. And two presses takes me to my calendar so I don't need a separate calendar button anywhere. Then I have email, browser and messaging buttons which are my three most used apps.
One flick to the right and that screen has a page of one touch quick dials. One flick left and I have a sports ticker widget that gives me updates on all my favorited teams that I also get notifications for when scores change.
And the list goes on. Maybe you want more home screens. There's Home replacement apps that can help. Check out aPanda in the app store. It's free, and you can use themes from other home apps.
Maybe you don't like a customizable UI because Apple doesn't let you have one.
No, I love customizable UIs. You're not talking to an Apple fanboy here. What I have an issue with is discovery or the lack of it. And I have an issue with it programmatically speaking because it makes for a much poorer developer experience. Poorer developer experiences mean poorer user experiences.
Quote
It could create more bugs but the upside is greater.
I don't see how. More bugs == harder to use. For early adopters that's great. Not for mom and pop.
Quote
The iPhone is and should be more refined for what it is.
Depends on what you're talking about. The iPhone SDK is far and away better than Android today in most areas. There are areas the Android SDK is better, but that's not a lot. The iPhone copy/paste took forever, but its implementation is a generation better than Android.
On the other hand, notifications, integration with FB and a few other things on Android are way better than on the iPhone. And I think the Android homescreens are not very well designed. The iPhone one is not really either, but its still more usable in the end.
Quote
It's been out longer, and it's on one phone. Android gives you one thing Apple doesn't, choices.
Choices can be good, but too many is bad.
Quote
Embrace it and get us PI for Android because many of us are going through major PalmOS withdrawal and Iambic is of no help.
Embrace it - sorry, I prefer the iPhone so far. But we've already started dev on Android. Its why I bought the Nexus One because we want to make the best darn Android app we can irregardless if its my main phone or not.
opuntia
11 January 2010 - 07:27 PM
I agree that some features were hidden, it took me a while to figure out widgets. I had the phone for a few weeks before I learned that holding down the home button will bring up a windows of recently/open apps.
So, regarding PI for android, what's the time frame till some kind a release, one to two weeks right!
So, regarding PI for android, what's the time frame till some kind a release, one to two weeks right!
Alex Kac - CEO/Founder
11 January 2010 - 08:00 PM
I wish it was one to two weeks. Since we're having to do everything (calendar, tasks) from our own database + sync, it'll probably be late this year.
Alex Kac - CEO/Founder
12 January 2010 - 12:47 PM
Unfortunately it takes awhile to write an app like PI.
dan55
14 January 2010 - 06:30 AM
Alex Kac - CEO/Founder, on 09 January 2010 - 02:31 PM, said:
opuntia, on 09 January 2010 - 10:51 AM, said:
It allows app greater access to key phone API's compare to the iphone.
Are you sure about that? As far as I can tell that's not really true. I still have no access to calendaring. We still have to do our own sync and databases and all that.
!?!?!? rubbish! why do they do it?! are they trying to kill their sales/make my life harder
mmmm......wonder how long symbian will survive :D
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